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I have noticed 3 small cracks over a a span of maybe 6 inches in one of my I-joists' bottom flange. It's ironically only on one side.

I suspect this is triggered by the top flange which has a ridiculous amount of bark just above the cracks.

I spoke to 3 different people:

  • The builder says "it's not uncommon to see these small cracks. It's wood after all. The I-Joist is designed with safety factor to account for these imperfections". He only has seen the photos and I suspect he does not want to perform the repairs (house was built 8 years ago).

  • LP Corp (I-Joist) engineer, who has only seen pictures as well, recommends to sister a piece of LVL next to it. I would do this in a heartbeat, but this is in a section of basement where main plumbing lines as well as HVAC go through. Would require quite a bit of work.

  • Local structural engineer who visited my house. He also says it's an imperfection and he is not overly worried. He does not think sistering or even shoring up is needed.

I am still looking for a 4th opinion on this site. What bothers me is no one was really able to explain what triggered those cracks (see photos). The only thing located on the floor above is a kitchen dresser which spans over 3 I-Joists. It weighs at the most 200 pounds.

Note: no sagging or bouncy floor presently.

Should I listen to local structural engineer and forget about it or should I sister another I-Joist or LVL ? Bottom flange sideways

Top flange - bark

top view bottom flange - crack

top view bottom flange - crack

enter image description here

Machavity
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dstmartin
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6 Answers6

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I would be concerned.

The top and bottom sections that I-joist, the flanges are what carry the load. The bottom flange is in tension, and the upper flange is in compression (for a typical floor joist application).

The ability of the lower flange to resist tension - being pulled apart - is what makes any I-beam work.

A crack in the lower flange compromises the ability of that flange to resist tension.

As for the comment by the builder that "it's not uncommon to see these small cracks. It's wood after all. The I-Joist is designed with safety factor to account for these imperfections" may or may not be valid. First of all, it's what I would expect the builder to say. It all depends on what load/tension that bottom flange was designed to withstand, and how much the cracks reduces that design load.

Here's a made up example. Say that the flange, if perfect, can withstand 10,000 lbs of tension. Now with the cracks shown, that flange can only withstand 5,000 lbs. If you're floor load only causes 3,000 lb of tension on that flange, then you're OK. But if your floor load puts 7,000 lbs of tension on that flange, then you have a problem.

SteveSh
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Disclaimer: I am not a structural engineer.

I don't see anything seriously concerning on the cracks because they don't seem to be stress fractures that have compromised the I-beam. If you had a crack that ran the length of the board or cut anywhere but the grain of the board, I'd be more concerned. The beam as a unit itself seems intact.

As far as sistering (if you want to go that route), the process there would be to buy another 2x4 (or 2x3, hard to tell), glue the bottom rim (construction adhesive), and then screw this new board to the bottom over the glue. This would only be needed over the area where the crack is. If you want peace of mind, you're not talking a lot of money to do it. I wouldn't add any more I-beams.

Machavity
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That bottom photo looks pretty bad. It reminds me of a “notch” in the bottom chord which is not allowed. Look on page 7 of their installation guide and you’ll see it is prohibited.

https://p.widencdn.net/l6alxy

However, you are correct that it will be difficult to repair. If you don’t have sagging floors, you may want to leave it alone.

To see how much it’s stressed, I’d contact the supplier and see how stressed the joists are on each side of this joists. That is to say, seldom are joists stressed to their failure point and you can have them check to see if the joists on each side of the notched joist can absorb its load.

Lee Sam
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This type of floor support element is considered normally to be simply supported. What this means is that maximum shear force occurs at the supports and maximum bending moment occurs near the middle of the span. What does this mean for you? The web portion of the joist is what primarily resists the shear load. The flanges (your cracked part) are what primarily resist your bending moment.

Assuming you are located in the US, UK, or Canada and I am pretty sure most places that have licensing requirements for Professional Engineers, means that the advice the structural engineer gave you, they a liable for. You should either receive a letter or a report from the engineer stating their findings and recommendations. This documents should be signed and bear their professional seal.

In terms of the three comments you initially got, the contractor is hopefully basing their statement on plenty of previous experience dealing with the product. Ultimately they have no professional liability in the matter. If they were the initial contractor, they will not get paid to do any remedial work so they will tend to try to push it off until the warranty period expires and then not deal with you at all. There is no profit in it for them to do the work. A few exceptions might be if they know it will lead to future work, or are trying to develop their reputation.

If your contractor was just a random one you just called up to look at it, then they may be giving you good advice and trying to save you some money. They may also be basing it on their past experience where they see the time an effort to come up with a reasonable estimate usually tends to scare the customer off and winds up being a waste of their time.

The engineer that works for the manufacturing company may be biased if the advice of sistering the joist results in a sale going through them. They may also be overly cautious if you wound up talking to a more junior engineer.

The independent local engineer has little to no stake in the matter. If they say it does not require repair, they are on the hook if something goes wrong in the future. Where they might have some bias is if they get follow up work for the design of the repair.

While sistering the joist will strengthen your floor, it may be overkill for your repair needs. Because most of your bottom flange is still intact and you are on a shorter span than what the joist is designed for you may still have adequate support. Alternatively if after going through the calculations you figure your joist is too damaged to adequately support the load, you may only need to add a steel plate to the under side of the bottom flange. Some joist manufactures do not support any types of repairs to these structural elements while others do. It may be as simple as adding the equivalent of something like the following Simpson strong tie part.

enter image description here

Ideally you would nail this in such away that is pans over the cracked areas. You can check with the joist manufacturer if this type of repair is acceptable and what their plate sizing and nailing recommendations are. Because the plate is relatively thin, it will make placing a ceiling potentially slightly easier in the future if you should ever decide to finish your basement.

Forward Ed
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The builder says "it's not uncommon to see these small cracks. It's wood after all. The I-Joist is designed with safety factor to account for these imperfections". He only has seen the photos and I suspect he does not want to perform the repairs (house was built 8 years ago).

Yes, this person has an active interest in not being on the hook for this issue.


LP Corp (I-Joist) engineer, who has only seen pictures as well, recommends to sister a piece of LVL next to it. I would do this in a heartbeat, but this is in a section of basement where main plumbing lines as well as HVAC go through. Would require quite a bit of work.

Sistering doesn't always mean full-span. It should be assessed to see whether partial span would suffice. Sistering with metal usually requires shorter spans.


Local structural engineer who visited my house. He also says it's an imperfection and he is not overly worried. He does not think sistering or even shoring up is needed.

I would keep track of the crack over the next year and take a consistent picture monthly.

Try various tests like having a person or two walk above this joist and check for any worrying movement. Bear in mind that static loads have different joist calculation requirements compared to dynamic loads.

MonkeyZeus
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I am not a wood person, but while aware all woods have defects and were visually examined and graded, I am leaning on the thought that some of the defects can get worse over time, especially splits, which depends heavily on the environment (too humid/too dry, too frequent moisture/volume changes...) and the cycles of loading/unloading.

Would the worsening occur? When and the effect of such deterioration is everybody's guess. The safety factor in design assures the joist will not fail in a sudden manner with minor defects, but it does not address other issues associated with excessive deterioration of the bottom chord, such as increased deflection, and overstress of floor covering and adjacent joists. These potentials will hang over my head like a dark cloud.

The good news is that your engineer has concluded the defects will not affect the performance of the joist, thus the floor, in the immediate future, but he certainly would not assure the defects of the joist will not get worse through a single visit and visual inspection. Therefore, preparing for the worst is the better/prudent approach.

As someone has pointed out - marking and observation the defects is a good way under this situation. Also, you can purposely load the joist to deflect, then unload, and noticing whether the cracks would open more or not. If the crack gets larger on loading and closes upon unloading, I'll elect to strengthen the joist.

There are many ways to strengthen the joist, I prefer to stiffen the web panel by adding a thin strip of the wood board on both sides of the web using construction adhesive. I suggest the height of the board should cover 1/3 of the depth of the web, and it should extend 18" beyond the farthest crack. You might have to perform the repair several times during the stay in the house, as the boards may peel open after time.

Hope this makes sense and helps.

r13
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