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I have a situation: a handyman “upgraded” my electric panel in the garage to 200 Amps last year. This year I wanted to install an EV charger and called an electrician. He saw the 200 Amps electric panel and then went outside to check the Main panel and found out that it is supplying 100 Amps to the house (PGE in California).

So my 50 amp EV charger would basically pull half the amperage coming into my house! The electrician said that converting the main panel to 200 amps will cost thousands of dollars because he’ll have to dig up the ground and change the cable that connects PGE to my house to bear the new load.

I then called the original handyman who “upgraded” my electric panel. He came over and agreed that the Main panel is supplying only 100 amps to the house. But he said he’ll upgrade the main panel to 200 amps and there is no need to dig up the underground cable that supplies power to the main panel from PGE .

So who is right in this case? Electrician says he’ll have to change the main cable but I can still install the EV charger provided I’m using it during low usage hours. Handyman says he can just upgrade the main panel to 200 without touching anything underground!

isherwood
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4 Answers4

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There are a bunch of different pieces here, each of which can limit your charging:

Load Calculation

This is the first step. This involves a bunch of calculations including, but not limited to:

  • Size of the house
  • HVAC equipment
  • Cooking equipment (lots of special rules that lower the total load from what you might expect)
  • Required circuits for kitchens, bathrooms, etc.
  • Major appliances such as clothes dryers and water heaters
  • EV charging (but more on that below)

At 100A, you could be (without including EV charging) near the max (or over and lucky) or could be just fine with room to spare (particularly if you use gas for heating, water heating, clothes dryer, cooking). You need to figure out this number because electrical inspector and utility will rely on this number for everything else.

Utility Feeder

This is the part that the electrician said was 100A and the handyman (who I wouldn't trust) said didn't matter. It matters. A lot. In my neighborhood with overhead lines, all the lines were replaced with 200A lines several years ago due to lots of repeated storm damage. The utility (or their contractor) replaced the line anyway when I had my electrician upgrade from 100A to 200A - probably because it easier for them to always replace than to figure out what's good and what's not. But with underground (or a long distance overhead) it can get more complicated, and expensive.

Main Panel

There are two issues with the main panel. It needs to be capable of handling the service size and the main breaker needs to match the service size. It is possible to have a 200A main panel with a 100A main breaker to safely work with a 100A feeder. In that situation a feeder upgrade would just need a main breaker swap. It is also possible to have a 100A main panel with a 100A main breaker and then a feeder upgrade to 200A would require replacement of the main panel to make use of the full 200A.

Subpanel Feed

The feed from the main panel to the subpanel (your existing 200A panel) can be any size. The breaker in the main panel (unless you feed the entire service capacity to the subpanel via lugs in the main panel) needs to be at or below the subpanel feed wire capacity. A typical example might be a 60A breaker on 2 AWG aluminum wire that can handle up to 90A. The subpanel might have a main breaker (purely as a disconnect) which can be larger than the feed feed breaker - e.g., a 200A breaker because it came bundled with the panel even though you are only feeding it 100A (or even 60A).

EVSE Requirement

EVSE (a.k.a., "the charger") is expected to be in continuous use (more than 3 hours at a time) so that requires a derate. Which means:

  • 15A circuit = 12A available
  • 20A circuit = 16A available
  • 30A circuit = 24A available
  • 40A circuit = 32A available
  • 50A circuit = 40A available

That is, you provision 50A but the EVSE actually only uses 40A. Don't worry, that's totally normal and factored into things. But it means that when it comes to a Load Calculation that 50A counts as 50A even though it is only feeding 40A.

So where does that leave you? That depends mostly on how much you have available out of 100A after a Load Calculation and on the cost to upgrade (heavy-up), compared with the cost of a system that automatically adjusts EV charging as needed.

If you have at least 20A (at 240V) available then the simple and easy thing to do, provided there are no other issues (e.g., subpanel feed circuit capacity), is to install your EVSE and configure it for the maximum available (e.g., 20A circuit with 16A actual usage) based on the Load Calculation.

If you really need more power than the Load Calculation allows then you either need a heavy-up or you can get EVSE that monitors power usage and adjusts automatically. One popular choice is the Emporia with PowerSmart, but there are many others. Just make sure that whatever you get:

  • Has UL or ETL certification (certain online sellers sell many items that don't have UL or ETL certification and that can be dangerous with high power items such as EVSE)
  • Is hardwired. For a bunch of reasons (both cost and technical), you do NOT want to get a plug-in EVSE.
manassehkatz-Moving 2 Codidact
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Partial answer:

  • You can charge an EV slowly overnight without upgrading anything. There are LOTS of articles here on this site about that. In summary, if you usually don't drive hundreds of miles a day and usually leave the car parked all night, you'll usually be fine. In infrequent situations where you need a fast charge either use a different car or take your car to a charging station.

  • You may be able to get slightly faster charging (30A) on your 100A panel depending what other big electric things you have, by upgrading your garage but not your main feed. If you arrive home empty this might get you to 20% or 30% quickly enough for some of your needs.

As to whether you can cheaply upgrade your main feed, see comments.

jay613
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This is a textbook application for Dynamic Load Management/EVEMS

This puts CT clamps (current sensors) on your service wires and dynamically adjusts EV charge rate to use only the surplus power in your panel. The fact is, large appliances only use power when they are actively in use, but panels are sized for a reasonable worst case. So there is plenty of spare power almost all the time, and it does not seriously impinge EV charging.

Here's a page that goes much deeper into that.

So yeah. Wallbox Pulsar Plus, Emporia EVSE or Te_la Wall Connector, with appropriate matching power meter, and a data cable between them, in the $800 neighborhood... and you're all set. "That was easy!"

Of course you're saying 50A, and when novices say that, they almost always mean the "RV park outlet" being used properly here by CGP Grey, from 11:15 to 13:15. It was foolishly popularized for home charging by "the crowd". You're not doing that. Good money after bad, in this application.

....Well, you can force it to work with a DCC "dumb load shed" device, a very clunky and costly way to to the above trick. All-on, it will be double the cost of the above (just to get the socket, and you still need to buy the 'charger'). It will be clunky, messier, less usable, and worst of all, higher fire risk because of the many connections. If you already have a 'charger' with that plug, blind pursuit of the matching socket is a great example of "the fallacy of sunk costs". Don't fall for it - just sell it, or better yet, keep it in the trunk for its originally intended purpose, as CGP Grey demonstrated.

I have a situation: a handyman “upgraded” my electric panel in the garage to 200 Amps last year. This year I wanted to install an EV charger and called an electrician. He saw the 200 Amps electric panel and then went outside to check the Main panel and found out that it is supplying 100 Amps to the house (PGE in California).

Yeah, increasingly, "electricians" are a) non-qualified handymen, and b) former electricians bought out by private equity, who send salesmen out to overquote and overcharge for work (since they sub it out to an actual electrician). On top of that, you have all the PG&E nonsense which can quadruple the cost of a service upgrade. It's basically why SPAN exists.

Change of subject, look at your car's tires. I bet it says something like "Speed rating 130 MPH". Is that mandatory? Of course not. Same deal with a 200A panel - it's a never-exceed redline. So... If we disregard lack of license and permit, the "200A panel" conversion was fine as long as the main breaker is a 100A breaker (to protect your service wires from overload).

And actually, having a 200A bus on a 100A service has a neat side-effect: it means you can support solar up to 100A breaker/80A inverter limit.

I then called the original handyman who “upgraded” my electric panel. He came over and agreed that the Main panel is supplying only 100 amps to the house. But he said he’ll upgrade the main panel to 200 amps and there is no need to dig up the underground cable that supplies power to the main panel from PGE

No, he's flat wrong. I mean I'm sure it works for HIM, he has lots of happy customers, but eventually one of them is going to have a really bad day and he won't be around for that (and certainly won't be called back). Also the fire marshal is going to have questions about how that upgrade was done without a permit. Handymen can't get permits. California is notorious for punitive measures toward homeowners do not not pull permits.

Also, come on: PG&E has smart meters. They get kWH used every 30 minutes. They do deep modeling of that data, and they're going to know when your usage reflects having a main breaker > 100A.

That video I linked up top is a 2-part Technology Connections series on fully electrifying a home with the 100A panel. Might be worth reviewing in full: using a Wallbox/TWC/Emporia is your first "dip of the toe" into the marvelous world of load management.

Harper - Reinstate Monica
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Truly, the only "person" who can answer your question is your electric utility.

The reason is this: service wiring is not under the purview of NEC nor your local building inspector. Normally, a customer doesn't even own those wires; the utility does. The electric meter is the point of demarcation - it's what separates building wiring, where NEC and your local inspector have control, from utility wiring.

So, if you want to upgrade to 200 A service, one of the first calls is to the utility. They'll send a field agent out to check the size of the existing conductors, whether they're direct-bury or in conduit, and how much load is already provisioned on the local transformer. They might determine that the existing wiring is adequate for 200 A service. (Note: in NEC land we have to use minimum 4/0 aluminum for our side of the service, but the utility might routinely use 3/0 or even 2/0 for their side. They allow more temperature rise on their conductors than NEC does for ours.) But if not, they'll tell you whether the existing conduit is good enough for them to simply pull new conductors into or whether they'll require you to install new conduit, at your expense, for them to pull their wires into. Either way, it's often the case that the customer (you) does not pay for the actual service conductors.

Greg Hill
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